Advice on new PC ?

[Howard]

Hi all -> A new PC for my 19yo son ....

I have been a Mac users for years and don't intend to change :) But my
son plays his beloved WoW at the highest level, and has been using my
Boot-camped iMac for the last 3 years very happily (WinXP)

He loves the one-piece design of the iMac and the fact that it is
incredibly quiet. He also loves the keyboard...

It appears to me that WoW doesn't require massive processing power,
because it runs wonderfully (he is really happy with it) on my 3 yo
iMac.

But I want to get a new machine (off the shelf) for him and I have
completely lost touch with what processors to look out for .... and what
machines I should look to, and which are quiet. I see Dell have one but
not sure about it.

Any advice would be really appreciated.


Howard

[m4rkiz]

Post by Howard
It appears to me that WoW doesn't require massive processing power,
because it runs wonderfully (he is really happy with it) on my 3 yo
iMac.
But I want to get a new machine (off the shelf) for him and I have
completely lost touch with what processors to look out for .... and what
machines I should look to, and which are quiet. I see Dell have one but
not sure about it.

if you don't want to assembly it yourself (imho best option)
look for anything with at least 2GHz dual core (pentium dual core, core 2
duo, i3/i5, not sure about amd but 2Ghz rule most likely applies) and nvidia
gtx 250 or higher (ati 4850 or higher) - it will easily run wow with max settings

if you want to buy anything other than dell, hp or other big manufacturers
make sure that you have some decent psu inside and that you can open
the case without voiding warranty

[Howard]

Post by Howard
It appears to me that WoW doesn't require massive processing power,
because it runs wonderfully (he is really happy with it) on my 3 yo
iMac.
But I want to get a new machine (off the shelf) for him and I have
completely lost touch with what processors to look out for .... and what
machines I should look to, and which are quiet. I see Dell have one but
not sure about it.

if you don't want to assembly it yourself (imho best option) look for
anything with at least 2GHz dual core (pentium dual core, core 2 duo,
i3/i5, not sure about amd but 2Ghz rule most likely applies) and nvidia
gtx 250 or higher (ati 4850 or higher) - it will easily run wow with max settings
if you want to buy anything other than dell, hp or other big manufacturers
make sure that you have some decent psu inside and that you can open the
case without voiding warranty

Thanks

Looking at Dell though they put a Pentium® P6100 in their all-in-ones.
How does one know whether that is 2GHz or dual core ?

H

[m4rkiz]

Post by Howard

Post by m4rkiz
if you want to buy anything other than dell, hp or other big manufacturers
make sure that you have some decent psu inside and that you can open the
case without voiding warranty

Looking at Dell though they put a Pentium® P6100 in their all-in-ones.
How does one know whether that is 2GHz or dual core ?

http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=50175

just what you need ;)

pair that with decent graphic card and you have decent pc

[Howard]

Post by m4rkiz

Post by Howard

Post by m4rkiz
if you want to buy anything other than dell, hp or other big manufacturers
make sure that you have some decent psu inside and that you can open the
case without voiding warranty

Looking at Dell though they put a Pentium® P6100 in their all-in-ones.
How does one know whether that is 2GHz or dual core ?

http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=50175
just what you need ;)
pair that with decent graphic card and you have decent pc

Thanks for that.

Howard

[Eddie Wall]

Post by m4rkiz

Post by Howard
It appears to me that WoW doesn't require massive processing power,
because it runs wonderfully (he is really happy with it) on my 3 yo
iMac.
But I want to get a new machine (off the shelf) for him and I have
completely lost touch with what processors to look out for .... and what
machines I should look to, and which are quiet. I see Dell have one but
not sure about it.

if you don't want to assembly it yourself (imho best option)

I could not agree more, I have always assembled my machines.... but I
have just commissioned a i7/2600k high spec overclocked unit and in
this case decided to pay the extra few bob for the overclockers
experience.... otherwise a good idea and experience... this time I
took the pleasure in choosing the specification and getting someone
else to "stabilise" it for me..

Dell is hard to beat for "off the shelf"...

Eddie


"Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any
more than going to a garage makes you a mechanic."

[Howard]

Post by Eddie Wall

Post by m4rkiz

Post by Howard
It appears to me that WoW doesn't require massive processing power,
because it runs wonderfully (he is really happy with it) on my 3 yo
iMac.
But I want to get a new machine (off the shelf) for him and I have
completely lost touch with what processors to look out for .... and what
machines I should look to, and which are quiet. I see Dell have one but
not sure about it.

if you don't want to assembly it yourself (imho best option)

I could not agree more, I have always assembled my machines.... but I
have just commissioned a i7/2600k high spec overclocked unit and in
this case decided to pay the extra few bob for the overclockers
experience.... otherwise a good idea and experience... this time I
took the pleasure in choosing the specification and getting someone
else to "stabilise" it for me..
Dell is hard to beat for "off the shelf"...

Tks for that Eddie ... who did you commission it from ? a private
sourse or an Irish operation ?

H

[Eddie Wall]

Post by Howard
Tks for that Eddie ... who did you commission it from ? a private
sourse or an Irish operation ?

No a UK Specialist Overclockers..... it is a seriously fast ( and
expensive ) piece of kit.... I want if for picture / video editing etc
etc, no companies in Ireland would have the experience do it as far
as I know.... from an over clocking perspective... !

PM me if you want specifics....!

Eddie

"Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any
more than going to a garage makes you a mechanic."

[Howard]

Post by Eddie Wall

Post by Howard
Tks for that Eddie ... who did you commission it from ? a private
sourse or an Irish operation ?

No a UK Specialist Overclockers..... it is a seriously fast ( and
expensive ) piece of kit.... I want if for picture / video editing etc
etc, no companies in Ireland would have the experience do it as far
as I know.... from an over clocking perspective... !
PM me if you want specifics....!
Eddie
"Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any
more than going to a garage makes you a mechanic."

Tks. I know overclockers... must check them out.


H

[Ulick Magee]

Post by Eddie Wall
No a UK Specialist Overclockers..... it is a seriously fast ( and
expensive ) piece of kit.... I want if for picture / video editing etc
etc, no companies in Ireland would have the experience do it as far
as I know.... from an over clocking perspective... !

The latest Intel Core i5 and i7 CPUs have overclocking built-in in
effect, when a core reaches 100% utilisation it'll increase its clock
speed above the nominal value - subject to the CPU temp not rising too far.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turbo_Boost

Overclocking used to be a big deal 10 and 15 years ago - when often the
only real difference between a £100 CPU and a £200 CPU was the clock
speed stamped on the package, and if you knew what you were doing you
could get big gains 'for free' or perhaps the cost of a better cooler.
In this day and age of dual/quad/hex core chips and turbo boost, it's
kinda hard to see the big wins. If you really need more performance then
it's usually available for not all that much more money, and no messing
about with warranties etc.

Makes me wonder what, if anything, you're really getting for your money
with an overclocked machine these days?

Post by Eddie Wall
PM me if you want specifics....!

Ah, go on, spill...

[Eddie Wall]

On Fri, 11 Mar 2011 22:29:00 +0000, Ulick Magee

Post by Ulick Magee
Overclocking used to be a big deal 10 and 15 years ago - when often the
only real difference between a £100 CPU and a £200 CPU was the clock
speed stamped on the package, and if you knew what you were doing you
could get big gains 'for free' or perhaps the cost of a better cooler.

No days it is like 25%-50% inccreases... a big deal IMHO..

Post by Ulick Magee
In this day and age of dual/quad/hex core chips and turbo boost, it's
kinda hard to see the big wins. If you really need more performance then
it's usually available for not all that much more money, and no messing
about with warranties etc.

I would rather be at the "cutting edge" and struggling with the
technology than having a "tame" system... YMMV

For sale ell Poweredge server motherboard with case.. absolutym
unesed..

Eddie
"Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any
more than going to a garage makes you a mechanic."

[Eddie Wall]

Post by Eddie Wall
On Fri, 11 Mar 2011 22:29:00 +0000, Ulick Magee

Post by Ulick Magee
Overclocking used to be a big deal 10 and 15 years ago - when often the
only real difference between a £100 CPU and a £200 CPU was the clock
speed stamped on the package, and if you knew what you were doing you
could get big gains 'for free' or perhaps the cost of a better cooler.

No days it is like 25%-50% inccreases... a big deal IMHO..

Post by Ulick Magee
In this day and age of dual/quad/hex core chips and turbo boost, it's
kinda hard to see the big wins. If you really need more performance then
it's usually available for not all that much more money, and no messing
about with warranties etc.

I would rather be at the "cutting edge" and struggling with the
technology than having a "tame" system... YMMV
For sale ell Poweredge server motherboard with case.. absolutym
unesed..

Spell checkers obviously don't work when you are sleep walking (typing
)

I had a backup Poweredge 1600sc server case and dual Xeon MOBO ( NO
CPU OR RAM ( may have a2 gigs stick here somewhere ) , brand new and
totally unused..... it is for "sale" with proceeds to charity or free
to take away to any registered charity..

Eddie




"Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any
more than going to a garage makes you a mechanic."

[Eddie Wall]

On Fri, 11 Mar 2011 22:29:00 +0000, Ulick Magee

Post by Ulick Magee
Ah, go on, spill...

LOL..................

==============================================================

The specs of the PC you ordered are as below:


• Quiet Lian Li PC-B10 Aluminium Black


• 2 x Quiet Zalman 120mm Fans


• NZXT Sentry 2, 5 Fans Controller, Touch Screen


• Quiet Coolermaster 1000W Modular SLI / XFire 6 x PCI-E


• Intel Core i7 2600K Overclocked 4.80GHz Per Core


• CoolIT ECO A.L.C.


• Asus P8P67 Pro motherboard, 4xDIMM, Max. 32GB, ATX (USB 3.0, SATA

3.0)


• 16GB (4 x 4GB) Mushkin PC12800 1600MHz DDR3


• ATI HD6970 2GB graphics cards


• Integrated 7.1 Channel Audio


• 120GB Ultrafast Sandforce Solid State Drive SATA II


• New 2000GB SATA III (Requires SATA III)


• New 2000GB SATA III (Requires SATA III)


• Samsung Blu Ray Reader & DVD +/- Rewriter


• Internal Memory Card Reader


• Integrated 10/100/1000Mbps


• 2 Front + 4 Back Ports


• 2 x USB 3.0 Ports (On Back)


• 24 Inch Iiyama LED E2472HDS Wide, VGA/DVI/HDMI, 1920x1080,


5000000:1, 2ms


• Dead Pixel Checking Before Shipment


• HDMI To HDMI (Gold Plated)


• Logitech MK120 Keyboard and mouse set


• Operating System Genuine Windows 7 Professional (64bit Version)


• Performance Optimization


• 2 Years Return to Base Warranty - (1st year parts and labour, 2nd

year labour only)

================================================================
Lets hope it lasts me 7 years like the last beast dual Xeon I
have..................

Eddie
"Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any
more than going to a garage makes you a mechanic."

[Ulick Magee]

Post by Eddie Wall
On Fri, 11 Mar 2011 22:29:00 +0000, Ulick Magee

Post by Ulick Magee
Ah, go on, spill...

LOL..................

Well, you can't go waving your 'virtual willy' around without being
asked to measure up! LOL

And as this is ie.comp some of us are just interested for the sake of
technology :)

Post by Eddie Wall
• Intel Core i7 2600K Overclocked 4.80GHz Per Core

Holy crap. The new 'Sandy Bridge' CPUs only go up to 3.4GHz nominal -
maybe 3.8 or 4.0 with turbo boost (TM) but that's only intended to be a
peak, temporary, heat-limited speed anyway.

4.8 is some going, especially if it can sustain that speed for any
length of time. Must be some serious cooling!

Post by Eddie Wall
• 120GB Ultrafast Sandforce Solid State Drive SATA II

Yep. No point having a whizz-bang chip without storage that can keep up!

Post by Eddie Wall
• 24 Inch Iiyama LED E2472HDS Wide, VGA/DVI/HDMI, 1920x1080,

Remember when a 17" CRT was big (and they sure were big)? You needed a
strong, deep desk to put it on and when it needed shifting and you could
only get at it at arms' reach it was hernia time :)

Post by Eddie Wall
• Operating System Genuine Windows 7 Professional (64bit Version)

The boat anchor!

Post by Eddie Wall
• Performance Optimization

Deleting Windows LOL

Post by Eddie Wall
Lets hope it lasts me 7 years like the last beast dual Xeon I
have..................

I always find that buying a cheap system is a total waste of money.
Buying the most expensive thing going is a waste too, it will have a
long lifetime but you pay well above the odds to get the 'best'
performance available which will be eclipsed within a few months.
Something which costs 70-80% of the 'best available' gives a long
lifetime with good performance and is the best value IMHO

My Macbook* is almost 4 years old now, but should last me a few more
years. I got 8 years out of my Gateway 750MHz Athlon desktop :) with a
couple of RAM and HDD upgrades along the way. If I was so inclined, I
could still use it today with a lightweight Linux window manager like LXDE.

*I'm not a fan of OSX / iOS at all and all the restrictions that come
with them, I like Apple hardware but run Linux in it.


Was it you who got some giveaway end-of-line Dell servers a few years
back? That can't be seven years ago, can it??

[Eddie Wall]

On Sun, 13 Mar 2011 23:55:54 +0000, Ulick Magee

Post by Ulick Magee

Post by Eddie Wall
On Fri, 11 Mar 2011 22:29:00 +0000, Ulick Magee

Post by Ulick Magee
Ah, go on, spill...

LOL..................

Well, you can't go waving your 'virtual willy' around without being
asked to measure up! LOL
And as this is ie.comp some of us are just interested for the sake of
technology :)

Me too.........

Post by Ulick Magee

Post by Eddie Wall
• Intel Core i7 2600K Overclocked 4.80GHz Per Core

Holy crap. The new 'Sandy Bridge' CPUs only go up to 3.4GHz nominal -
maybe 3.8 or 4.0 with turbo boost (TM) but that's only intended to be a
peak, temporary, heat-limited speed anyway.
4.8 is some going, especially if it can sustain that speed for any
length of time. Must be some serious cooling!

Well the new B3 Mobos got over the Potential Sandy Bridge Sata 3gig
ports probs and apparently go like the bejeesus.. ! I was looking at
the 980/990 but too expensive at the moment and not a huge gain/// at
a constant 4.8 the 2600's are going to be good enough ;)

Post by Ulick Magee

Post by Eddie Wall
• 120GB Ultrafast Sandforce Solid State Drive SATA II

Yep. No point having a whizz-bang chip without storage that can keep up!

I was tempted for SATAIII SSD but I believe it does not make much
difference..

Post by Ulick Magee

Post by Eddie Wall
• 24 Inch Iiyama LED E2472HDS Wide, VGA/DVI/HDMI, 1920x1080,

Remember when a 17" CRT was big (and they sure were big)? You needed a
strong, deep desk to put it on and when it needed shifting and you could
only get at it at arms' reach it was hernia time :)

The eyes are not as good as they used to be and I am well used to
using both halves of the screen as matched windows, so big is better
especially for drawing / messing with photos..

Post by Ulick Magee

Post by Eddie Wall
• Operating System Genuine Windows 7 Professional (64bit Version)

The boat anchor!

I know.... limited options...

Post by Ulick Magee

Post by Eddie Wall
• Performance Optimization

Deleting Windows LOL

Post by Eddie Wall
Lets hope it lasts me 7 years like the last beast dual Xeon I
have..................

I always find that buying a cheap system is a total waste of money.
Buying the most expensive thing going is a waste too, it will have a
long lifetime but you pay well above the odds to get the 'best'
performance available which will be eclipsed within a few months.
Something which costs 70-80% of the 'best available' gives a long
lifetime with good performance and is the best value IMHO

I agree, the 2600K was well priced...

Post by Ulick Magee
My Macbook* is almost 4 years old now, but should last me a few more
years. I got 8 years out of my Gateway 750MHz Athlon desktop :) with a
couple of RAM and HDD upgrades along the way. If I was so inclined, I
could still use it today with a lightweight Linux window manager like LXDE.
*I'm not a fan of OSX / iOS at all and all the restrictions that come
with them, I like Apple hardware but run Linux in it.

I am very very tempted to load Linux on the old Dual Xeon and see how
it goes... have to read up a bit more on it...

Post by Ulick Magee
Was it you who got some giveaway end-of-line Dell servers a few years
back? That can't be seven years ago, can it??

Yes.... I got a pair of 1600sc 's at a stupid price and popped the
second CPU into one of them.. don't remember to be honest if it was as
long ago as 7 years,,, I was going by the age of the some other gear I
had around then... it was a wee while ago though... must check it
out.... seems like 7 years... !

Eddie
"Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any
more than going to a garage makes you a mechanic."

[Ulick Magee]

Post by Eddie Wall
Well the new B3 Mobos got over the Potential Sandy Bridge Sata 3gig
ports probs and apparently go like the bejeesus.. ! I was looking at
the 980/990 but too expensive at the moment and not a huge gain/// at
a constant 4.8 the 2600's are going to be good enough ;)

Yeah heard about that SATA bug! Not the first time Intel have been
bitten by something like that but to their credit they usually fix it to
everyone's satisfaction.
It would be really impressive if that setup can sustain a continuous
4.8GHz across all cores! i.e. dump all that heat on a continuous basis.

Post by Eddie Wall
I was tempted for SATAIII SSD but I believe it does not make much
difference..

As I understand it, a good SSD will be able to saturate the interface...

Post by Eddie Wall
I am very very tempted to load Linux on the old Dual Xeon and see how
it goes... have to read up a bit more on it...

Depends what you use it for - but for general use with a GUI there are
several options (Ubuntu/Fedora/openSUSE/and many others) which are
suitable for most uses. I'd recommend openSUSE in particular because it
supports a wide range of hardware, and desktop managers (GNOME, KDE,
LXDE, and others) which go from heavy down to lightweight. It also has
the full set of development packages (compilers etc) and server packages
(Apache, MySQL) available if you want them.
Something like Ubuntu is easier if all you want is a desktop and if you
are prepared to meet higher (more recent) hardware minima.
--
Ulick Magee

When you hear the ADVANCE WARNING you know that fall-out will start in
about one hour's time. If you have not already done so, complete the
shielding of the windows and doors of your refuge room as described on
pages 14 to 19. Shut all windows and outside doors. Bring your car under
cover so that it will not be covered with radioactive dust afterwards.
From this point on, you should restrict your telephone calls so as not
to interfere with essential Civil Defence communications. Continue
listening to Radio Éireann.

[Eddie Wall]

On Mon, 14 Mar 2011 00:49:58 +0000, Ulick Magee

Post by Ulick Magee

Post by Eddie Wall
Well the new B3 Mobos got over the Potential Sandy Bridge Sata 3gig
ports probs and apparently go like the bejeesus.. ! I was looking at
the 980/990 but too expensive at the moment and not a huge gain/// at
a constant 4.8 the 2600's are going to be good enough ;)

Yeah heard about that SATA bug! Not the first time Intel have been
bitten by something like that but to their credit they usually fix it to
everyone's satisfaction.
It would be really impressive if that setup can sustain a continuous
4.8GHz across all cores! i.e. dump all that heat on a continuous basis.

From my research... it can maintain the high speed and as it is water
cooled the temp is not a prob and most important virtually silent, on
that aspect anyway. The box fans are "quite" too as is the PSU... so
fingers crossed... The Poweredge I have is a noisy git. !

Snip.....

Post by Ulick Magee
Depends what you use it for - but for general use with a GUI there are
several options (Ubuntu/Fedora/openSUSE/and many others) which are
suitable for most uses. I'd recommend openSUSE in particular because it
supports a wide range of hardware, and desktop managers (GNOME, KDE,
LXDE, and others) which go from heavy down to lightweight. It also has
the full set of development packages (compilers etc) and server packages
(Apache, MySQL) available if you want them.
Something like Ubuntu is easier if all you want is a desktop and if you
are prepared to meet higher (more recent) hardware minima.

I may try Ubuntu for my first test....... I may be back with lots of
questions..

Eddie


"Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any
more than going to a garage makes you a mechanic."

[Eddie Wall]

On Sun, 13 Mar 2011 23:55:54 +0000, Ulick Magee
<***@feckoff.invalid> wrote:
Snip///////////

Post by Ulick Magee
Was it you who got some giveaway end-of-line Dell servers a few years
back? That can't be seven years ago, can it??

Just checked Dec 2004.......... time flies....

Eddie
"Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any
more than going to a garage makes you a mechanic."

[c***@webtv.net]

I am thinking later on this year, I will plug in my phone (AT&T land
line phone) and call Velocity Micro in Richmond,Virginia and order me a
new Velocity Micro Vector Windows 7 desk top computer.

I sort of kind of doubt my old Velocity Micro ProMagix (Windows XP Home)
desk top computer is worth upgrading to Windows 7.It would probally cost
almost as much as a new computer to get it upgraded.
I don't tote, I like desk top computers.
http://www.velocitymicro.com
cuhulin

[Howard]

Post by Eddie Wall
No a UK Specialist Overclockers.

Was shipping a cost and hassle factor ?

H

[Eddie Wall]

Post by Howard

Post by Eddie Wall
No a UK Specialist Overclockers.

Was shipping a cost and hassle factor ?

It cost a lot... so they threw in the shipping & Insurance after we
bartered... it was a few days to get components and build, and 3-4
days testing and optimisation...I am expecting it at the end of the
week...........

Eddie

"Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any
more than going to a garage makes you a mechanic."

[Ulick Magee]

Post by Howard

Post by Eddie Wall
No a UK Specialist Overclockers.

Was shipping a cost and hassle factor ?

Off-topic, but.. don't get me started!
Recently Sproglet No.2 arrived which meant we had to dig out the
0-12months car seat from the attic. For some reason or another those
little pads which go on the shoulder straps are missing. Can any car
seat vendor here supply them - NOPE but of course they will happily sell
us a whole new seat at EUR150+! Foxtrot Oscar to that! Amazon.co.uk do
them - 3.99UKP - Great! but they don't send 'car seats' outside the UK
and these things, although they only weigh 100g come under the category
of 'car seats' and they will not ship to ROI... "Computer Says No" Duh!!
GRRR!!!

There has to be a business opportunity for some canny bloke in NI to
take advantage of all the 'free UK shipping' etc. offers and then post
the stuff down here to the ultimate customer for a couple of quid mark-up!

[Eddie Wall]

On Mon, 14 Mar 2011 00:14:03 +0000, Ulick Magee

Post by Ulick Magee

Post by Howard

Post by Eddie Wall
No a UK Specialist Overclockers.

Was shipping a cost and hassle factor ?

Off-topic, but.. don't get me started!
Recently Sproglet No.2 arrived which meant we had to dig out the
0-12months car seat from the attic. For some reason or another those
little pads which go on the shoulder straps are missing. Can any car
seat vendor here supply them - NOPE but of course they will happily sell
us a whole new seat at EUR150+! Foxtrot Oscar to that! Amazon.co.uk do
them - 3.99UKP - Great! but they don't send 'car seats' outside the UK
and these things, although they only weigh 100g come under the category
of 'car seats' and they will not ship to ROI... "Computer Says No" Duh!!
GRRR!!!
There has to be a business opportunity for some canny bloke in NI to
take advantage of all the 'free UK shipping' etc. offers and then post
the stuff down here to the ultimate customer for a couple of quid mark-up!

Useless for your situation, but there are a number of UK companies
will do that... UK address and some will even consolidate your
purchases for you... mainly aimed at the Ebay market....


Annoys me all the on-line "catalogue companies".... like Screwfix et
al... that will not ship here even for shipping fees...

Most expesnive strip of water in Europe....

Eddie

"Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any
more than going to a garage makes you a mechanic."

[Grimly Curmudgeon]

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the

Post by Eddie Wall
Annoys me all the on-line "catalogue companies".... like Screwfix et
al... that will not ship here even for shipping fees...

I had a conversation with a Screwfix droid a few years ago, in which she
informed me that Parcelforce (as their carrier of choice at the time)
don't cover RoI. I told her that was a load of bullshit, as I'd had many
Parcelforce deliveries that were simply handled by An Post this end.
So, aside from making it up as she went along, she was oblivious to the
real reasons, which were (and are)

(1) simply that they can't be arsed, even for extra payment
(2) the contract with PF (as was) only covered the UK
(3) management blindness to a very worthwhile market just a hop away.